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General Approach for WSOBP Rules

Home Page – Flat Forums Rules Debates General Approach for WSOBP Rules

This topic contains 101 replies, has 22 voices, and was last updated by  prusch 6 years, 8 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 102 total)
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  • #1172

    mlayth
    Member

    Travis I was under the impression thats what this forum section was for..
    Discussing the rules of the game, rather than playing it :shock:

    #1173

    d->p
    Member

    I agree with Billy about rollbacks. To make it completely fair, each team should get close to the same number of shots. This prevents good teams from losing to a poor team on a hot streak while taking nothing away from the good teams. If your team makes 6 cups in a row, you’re pretty much going to win whether the other team get 0 shots or they get 6-8 shots. I would hate to come all the way across the country to play beer pong and not even get to take a shot, which could theoretically happen with rollbacks. That’s how it was last year, and the games were very fair.

    As far as the rebuttles, I think that they could be implemented in the prelims without causing any time issues and making it more fair at the same time. On the final day last year, when rebuttles were allowed, the rounds did not last much longer than the previous days. There MIGHT be 1-2 games per round that last slightly longer than the rest, but they would be over before you could set up for the next round. You could be setting up the other tables while the few games that do go to overtime finish up. If a team is good enough to force overtime, chances are that they would not take very long to hit the three overtime cups. You could even make it a one cup overtime in prelims, making it more fair and more exciting while only lasting a minute or two longer at most.

    #1174

    travis14
    Member

    Travis I was under the impression thats what this forum section was for..
    Discussing the rules of the game, rather than playing it :shock:

    No no i agree with you it defintly is to discuss things but like the chart and percentages just seems like that is a little much. i mean everyone has there own ideas of how they want to play but that just seems to be taking beer pong to a sceintific level. i mean i dont care either way but im just saying

    #1175

    mlayth
    Member

    Yeah I agree the graph is probably a bit much for the average player :wink:

    People were disagreeing with me that Rollbacks benefit good players, so why settle for talking about it in terms of opinion. That graph was already made and on my photobucket, so it wasn’t a big deal to post it up.

    Personally I think its amazing how much rollbacks really benefit you.
    Thats what encouraged me to start practicing until I could avg 16/20 cups.

    #1176

    travis14
    Member

    yes i think rollbacks do benefit teams but i can agree with rollbacks on 10 cups but not on 6 cups.. the way i see it is if there are rollbacks on 6 cups then there better be rebuttles because if a team starts hot and makes there first 4 or 5 shots the other team even if they are the best team in the tournament is in some trouble and you should be awared rebutlles if there are rollbacks.. i wasnt at last years WSOBP and i heard there was no rollbacks so i dont have a problem with no rollbacks

    #1177

    mlayth
    Member

    yeah I have to agree with you there. If theres no rebuttals I wouldn’t be happy having rollbacks.

    #1178

    gaw2069
    Member

    Mlayth def gets my respect for putting that much thought into beerpong…. and I thought I was the only person to do the same. But that being said….. i agree with Billy on this one. Doubles or no doubles….. unless you personally went to last yrs world series…. you wouldnt know how everyone from all over the USA played. I always assumed that even though Im damn good at pong….. that there had to be some teams who were at that 80% that you spoke of. Not even close bro. First off….. going 6 for 6 would be a miracle there…. trust me. Everyone knows that home field advantage means a shit load in pong. For example….. i can promise that I personally can dominate anyone in my basement, on my ping pong table in which ive played on for 8 yrs lol. Even the #1 team from ’06…. Team france….. they were good….. but honestly the team they beat… slippery fetus…. are much better. it was just that Josh and Mike on Fetus had a bad day….. thats all. So enough talkin bout mathematical variables….. and honestly for your own good…. do what I did months ago….. buy one of those bingbong tables on this site…… they r much lower than most… and takes gettin used to.

    #1179

    mlayth
    Member

    thanks gaw. I don’t personally own a bing bong table, but I live in maryland and all of the tournaments and leagues around here use them.. so I’ve gotten pretty familiar with their height at this point.

    I don’t doubt that no one was close to 80%.
    I’ve done a LOT of practicing to get as good as I am, and I still don’t quite touch that. Maybe by the time the world series comes around.

    Haha back on to the topic, I think I may have actually switched sides.
    I still insist that it benefits the better players to have rollbacks, but I started to consider what happens when two equal teams play each other.

    Like imagine 2 teams at 50%. 1 Team always hits together, then misses together, 1 team always hits a single ball a turn.

    The first team is going to end a 10 cup game 5 rounds sooner, even though both teams are shooting at the same %.

    So it adds a certain team luck factor when you have rollbacks.
    And if you consider 2 teams at 80% playing each other.. they could both be as good but whoever is unlucky enough to miss first is going to get totally smashed.

    I’ve heard good things about slippery fetus, but I don’t like them.
    They claimed TWICE they were going to come to a MD tournament and never showed either time. Bastards :(

    #1180

    d->p
    Member

    That’s definitely too much math for beer pong. All that goes out the window after 3 or 4 beers anyway. Then anything can happen. Let me sketch up a quick graph. As you can see, it starts off linear but somewhere between beers 3 and 4 it begins to follow a more unpredictable behavior. It even goes off the chart a few times.

    Anyway, look what came in today

    I guess we’ll have to break it in tonight.

    #1181

    William Gaines
    Keymaster

    mLayth,
    I think you’ve finally got what I’m saying. Sure, a good team may always lose to a bad team, but rollbacks can "magnify" the luck factor, as your example just pointed out with the two equal teams.

    I still don’t understand how you were trying to define the "stronger" team earlier. The only way that I can think of defining it would be that the stronger team is the team that ends sinks all the cups first, which, obviously, is directly related to how good the players are at sinking cups.

    d->p,
    Chill the fuck out man. Beer pong is just a game. No need to go spastic and collect all that data for such an in-depth/complex graph. Just play and have some fun. I am curious, though. How long did it take you to collect all that data? 5-10 years?

    #1182

    fraser1624
    Member

    anyone who played last year will say it is a fucking awesome time and the rules are just fine. when you play a shitload of beer pong games before the finals, the better team will advance…so ask anyone who was there, it works fine and i don’t recall anyone bitchin about the rules, everyone had an awesome time!

    #1183

    mlayth
    Member

    mLayth,
    I think you’ve finally got what I’m saying. Sure, a good team may always lose to a bad team, but rollbacks can "magnify" the luck factor, as your example just pointed out with the two equal teams.

    I still don’t understand how you were trying to define the "stronger" team earlier. The only way that I can think of defining it would be that the stronger team is the team that ends sinks all the cups first, which, obviously, is directly related to how good the players are at sinking cups.

    I understand what you were saying about the luck factor, I was addressing the part of your post where you said " I don’t believe rollbacks benefit the better team." On that point I’m still pretty solid :D

    As far as the stronger team, I still maintain that your definition doesn’t make sense. Thats like saying "Whoever scores the most touchdowns is the stronger football team"

    Thats obviously not true, because sometimes shit happens. Sometimes there is an upset and the best team in the world loses to amateurs. Whoever scores the most touchdowns doesn’t define the strongest team, it just defines the winner of that particular game.

    Same with beer pong, whoever hits the cups first in the fewer shots is the winner, but sometimes the winner just got lucky and happened to shoot better when overall the odds were against them.

    The better team is about, overall, who is the most likely to hit a cup when they shoot. Place a cup at the end of a table. Shoot 100 balls at it.

    However many balls you made it in, thats your shooting %.
    Of course there are other factors, like how well you resist distraction and how good you can shoot under pressure .. etc

    But the games about accuracy, so I define the better team as the team that is the most accurate with their shots.

    #1184

    gaw2069
    Member

    Mylath…… I 100% agree with you last posting….. skill cannot be defined in one game… cause always luck is present. But if u happened to actually play with with me in NV last yr… then u wouldnt even be bitching about this issue then. There were 2 days of preliminary games….. 11 games for each and EVERY team total. Take a look at Team France’s final record…. and ull notice…. that they actually LOST a few games. Billy and Duncan have already touched base on your input. Losing a few is actually just assumed….. and will have little effect on your overal placing. So your arguement has always been implimented… so no need to continue giving suggestions on it bro. if you are that lucky that you happen to use your luck out of 11 random games in 2 days…. then guess what…… your not so lucky after all…. u just know how to play pong.

    #1185

    mlayth
    Member

    Gaw, I must have misrepresented myself.

    I was never trying to get rollbacks into the game, all debates on my part were entirely conceptual. I’m not bitching about anything, remember, I am the guy that already had a graph created for the skill curve in beer pong.

    It should be obvious my interest is in how the game actually works.
    If you can’t infer it, I outright said I wasn’t for rollbacks anymore 3 posts ago.

    Furthermore, I really like what you said about how many games are played.
    That kind of volume alone is enough to ensure the winner is one of the best teams.

    I said in some other thread, the only rule that really matters is how far away your arm has to be from the cup :D

    #1186

    William Gaines
    Keymaster

    Furthermore, I really like what you said about how many games are played.
    That kind of volume alone is enough to ensure the winner is one of the best teams.

    That’s why we do it.

    Plus, if you are traveling half way across the country for a beer pong event, which a good number of the participants are (or even traveling from other countries), you’re probably expecting to play some beer pong – even if you are losing.

    We need to get a better idea of the exact number of entries before we know exactly how many games each team is guaranteed during the prelims, but it will probably be between 9 and 11 games. Of course, we’ll squeeze a few extras in there if possible.

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